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A quick note on resinoid based stones

Discussion in 'Sharpening forum' started by JBroida, Mar 16, 2014.

  1. JBroida

    JBroida Founding Member

    i just responded to a customer e-mail with the following, which i though might be of interest for some people here as well...

    Resinoid based stones respond to soaking and drying differently from ceramic, clay based, and magnesia based stones. Magnesia based stones, like the chocera, will crack when over-soaked due to magnesia (the binding agent) leaching out in the water. After a while, the stone looses structural stability. Clay based and ceramic stones do not have any cracking problems unless dropped (or sometimes when they are worn thin and you exert too much pressure in an unsupported section). Vitrified stones work in a similar way to the ceramic and clay based stones, but are often less firm and can break more easily when dropped and/or worn too thin. Resinoid based stones, like the gesshin 6000, arashiyama, kitayama, and even some of maxim's stones, respond to soaking differently. The soaking is actually not the issue at all. Soaking helps soften the stone, causing it to release more abrasive more quickly, improving tactile feedback, and helping create more mud. However, repeated soaking and drying, drying too quickly, or changes in humidity based on environment cause the stone to dry out unevenly. Because resinoid based stones are not as porous, air can not penetrate as quickly, nor can water escape in the same way. As water leaves the outer portion of the stone, the loss of mass causes the outside of the stone to shrink faster than the inside of the stone, which is the main cause of cracking with stones like this. Therefore, when it comes to resinoid based stones, you need to pick one of the following ways of dealing with them:
    -soak permanently
    -use as a splash and go stone
    -soak and dry, but dry very carefully and slowly, while paying attention to general humidity
     
  2. Jim

    Jim Old Curmudgeon Founding Member

  3. butch

    butch Founding Member

    sounds like best bet is a lidded box to really slow down the dry time. good info for sure
     
  4. PierreRodrigue

    PierreRodrigue Tactical Walrus Founding Member

    I tries a loose fitting lid, had serious mold build up. Whats the cure for that?
     
  5. Jay

    Jay No soup for you Founding Member

    Every now and then, I give my stones a dip in a mild bleach solution. Never had mold.
     
  6. Spaz

    Spaz Founding Member

    With more people talking about soaking their stones before use and the dramatic increase in complaints about said stones cracking I figured the extra soaking was playing a part in it. Chocera is a splash-n-go stone and should be used as such.
     
  7. butch

    butch Founding Member

    in my thoughts i woudl rather dip in white vinagar (mild) thinking even mild bleach might work the steel over harder
     
  8. JBroida

    JBroida Founding Member

    meh... i used to keep stones in a bucket of water with a cap full or two of bleach... its not really that harsh on the stones or knives... in fact, the water you splash on the stones is often bleach free, so its really a non-issue. However, it did cause another unforeseen problem... the bleach wore away at the ink that i had used to label my stones, so i ended up with quite a few white stones of similar grit and not knowing which was which until i used it again.
     
  9. Asteger

    Asteger Founding Member

    For what it's worth, bleach is a base not an acid like vinegar, and so (Butch) I think you might worry more about the vinegar, though I'm not sur if you need to. Another point about bleach is that it has quite a short half-life, something like 4 hours maybe, and so that would have an effect on any 'soaking strategies'. (I'm no chemist though and would suggest research if any of this is important to you.)
     
  10. JBroida

    JBroida Founding Member

    this is true... i had to add more bleach from time to time
     
  11. Bill Farrell

    Bill Farrell Founding Member

    Jon, when you say "cracking" for magnesia and resinoid stones, are you talking about the spider web stuff we see on choseras or cracks all the way through?
     
  12. butch

    butch Founding Member

    was not thinking about the chlorine escaping now it does sound more likly to be better.
     
  13. JBroida

    JBroida Founding Member

    both... the spiderweb stuff eventually leads to cracks all the way through
     
  14. marc4pt0

    marc4pt0 Founding Member

    Think I might need to add a little bleach to my water. I just leave them soaking pretty much permanently. They did travel once, and I just wrapped each stone in a kitchen towel and packed them into a deep half pan. The towels grew damp obviously, but eventually dried which was the signal for me to unwrap them to finish their drying
     
  15. V1P

    V1P Founding Member

    Very good knowledge here, I should pay more attention to my stones.

    Having any of them cracking is troublesome.
     
  16. kentos

    kentos Founding Member

    Interesting that the drying is what harms the stones vs the soaking. There are discussions on this in the razor honing world as well.
     

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