4k Stones

I've had a Naniwa arata 3k (mini chosera) ever since I've been sharpening my nice knives. It's always been one of my best stones and I haven't found a better finishing stone. It's quite fast for the grit and leaves a great edge, with a decent bit of bite.

Recently I entertained the idea of mixing it up and getting something in a similar grit range to see if anything could unseat the Naniwa from its throne. Although labelled 3k it's generally accepted that it should finish around the 4k mark.

Enter the challengers. There are two stones that I want to try, the King and Morihei 4k stones.

I took the cheap option and started with the King 4k. Given the price (I found one for just under AUD40) it seems like there's no way it could stand up to the Naniwa but after an initial test I think there's something here.

I lightly lapped it with a diamond plate and soaked for a couple of minutes as directed by the box. Used my go to SK gyuto which probably could've done with an initial start on something a bit coarser but I know the 3k Naniwa would've dealt with it easily.

First thoughts...

- It's a smaller stone. A bit shorter and narrower than the arata stones but does have a base. I might try and remove it as it would make for a nice travel sized finishing stone. You can buy a larger version but mine is the F-3.
- It's softer than the Naniwa and feels less "stony" or gritty. Has that sort of resinoid feel. I def prefer the feel of the Naniwa here.
- Quickly started to generate swarf but did appear to load up a little too.
- Definitely slower but I think also quite a bit finer than the Naniwa.

The edge is where it counts here and it seems to have left a nice fine edge, I think finer than the Naniwa 3k but still enough bite to get through capsicum (pepper) skins.

I don't think it would replace the Naniwa due to the slower speed but I really like where this edge has landed. I think this would work nicely after a 1-2k stone. Also all my knives are basic carbon so I have no idea how it would fare on something trickier but yeah very happy with this one so far. I'll keep updating as I use it and hopefully get the Morihei or other stones to compare.

 

The Gesshin 4K ceramic is probably my fave just because of the speed and tooth it creates. But it’s pricey.
Naniwa diamond 3k is interesting also cuts fast but I’m not sure I’ll ever really get used to the feedback of diamond stones for edge sharpening.
Shapton glass 4k has good speed good bang for your buck. I’m not really into the low height of shapton glass stones though.
Morihei 4K is what I now use weekly if I want a synthetic finisher instead of pulling out JNats. Picked mine up for maybe $75? From Bernal, good price for what it does. Very good stone for polishing core steel and edge sharpening. Good feedback. Good for people that want a JNat feeling synthetic stone. Speed probably more closer to chosera than Gesshin or shapton but not really a big deal to me though. It’s still much faster than using a JNat.
I haven’t used a Chosera 3k in like 6-7 years so it’s a bit difficult for me to compare these other stones to it. I think I sold it because I wanted a faster cutting stone? I do remember loving the feedback of the chosera, probably my fave of all the stones mentioned.

So my vote is for Morihei 4K if you can find it instock. It’s a good balance of value, good feedback, good finishing edge. Doesn’t load or dish. Isn’t the fastest, and isn’t the slowest. Both the Morihei and the Geshin work best permasoaked IMO.

Even though I’ve owned most of the stones you’re interested in I haven’t tested them side by side so comparing memories of a stone I used in 2015 to a stone I used 2019 to stone I use today there’s likely going to inaccuracies.
I will say if memory serves the Chosera might create the most refined edge of all these stones. So likely whatever you choose will be toothier and it wouldn’t be redundant to also use a Chosera.

 

Yes I've mostly heard good things about the Gesshin and Morihei 4ks. I previously owned a Morihei 6k and liked everything about it in use, but found it a bit too fine for my liking. I can also get a 4k locally in Aus so that's next on the list for me.

I forgot about the Shapton! I think I've always been confused by the grit ratings of the shaptons and it's turned me off them a little. Where Naniwa is on the finer side, I know Shaptons are typically coarse. At least for the kuromaku line.

For me the Naniwa 3k has been plenty fast. I find that I can follow up from a 500-600 without much trouble. I don't know if I'd try that with this new King stone based on my first use. I think it would take a looong time to get a nice even 4k edge.

In saying that I think this King is fairly fine for the grit rating. I will try it next in a progression from a Naniwa 1k and see how that goes. I've also got a Naniwa 2k en route, maybe the King will follow nicely from that. I'll test it all out and update here as I go.

 

Gritomatic has a great chart comparing grit ratings across a variety of brands.

https://www.gritomatic.com/cdn/shop/files/glgc.webp?v=16016503103606610594

 

You’re probably right about the chosera. I haven’t used one since around 2015 and my memory could be inaccurate.
To this day I use and love both the chosera 400 and 1k. The 1k might be a little slept on. Feels like a very aggressive 1200-1500 grit edge IMO and makes a pretty polish. It’s really great for just daily pro kitchen work.
Morihei feels sorta hard but produces mud easily in a JNat kinda way. Water management is very easy. Feels great to strop on.
Kinda weird there’s only like 5 or so 4k synthetic stones being distributed. I’m sure there’s more somewhere perhaps but it just seems like it’s the perfect finishing edge for most things.

 

I also like the 1k chosera. In fact I like all the ones I've tried so far, 400, 800, 1k and 3k. Got a 2k coming for when I really want some bite.

I agree that 4k is almost perfect for most things but sometimes I like to mix it up and go higher or lower.

These are the ~4k stones I'm aware of. I'm sure there are others. If you think of any please let me know and I'll add to the list or remove if needed.

Naniwa chosera 3k
Naniwa hayabusa 4k
Naniwa traditional 4k
Suehiro debado 4k
Suehiro rika 5k
Shapton glass 4k
Shapton pro 5k ?
King 4k
Morihei 4k
Imanishi 4k

Another Naniwa, but from what I've read the green brick could probably fit here too, even though it's designated as a 2k. Too many stones to try and I'm only thinking of synthetic options

 

For fear of vexing Mr.Wizard, allow me to share the README that is meant to travel inseparably with the chart image

https://myplace.frontier.com/~mr.wizard/GLGC/README.txt

 

The SG4000 has HR and HC variants – the HR slightly balanced toward the refining of stainless and supersteel edges; the HC tipped to the polishing of carbon blades; if I understand correctly.

 

Thanks. I had no idea. I had encountered the chart on Gritomatic's website well before I was ever on any knife forums.

 

The shapton glass 4k I always found to be an exceptional edge finisher for kitchen knives. Love how slow wearing they are as well. Great balance of tooth and refinement for general kitchen work.